(no subject)

[threeplusfire]

I've always wondered why we are encouraged to celebrate Mexico's independence day, but not the Texas independence day. During my years at the university I remember the annual party sponsored by the YTC (Young Texas Conservatives) as no one else would do it. It often earned the wrath of Mexican American student groups, who railed about the racism, the suffering caused by the Texans who fought against the Mexican government. As if their quest for independence was less pure than the quest by the Mexicans against the Spanish government. I just never understood the business and frankly it irritates me. No movement has ever been pure, except perhaps for Joan of Arc. I think we should acknowledge the mistakes and faults in our histories, but move on and celebrate the idealist goals, try to carry that spirit on and improve. Is that too much to ask? Crikey.

There are dice and mellowcreme pumpkins all over the floor. Cleaning drives me crazy. I put Suicide Kings on to keep me company. Last night I started reading the second book in Cornwell's Arthur epic, Enemy of God. Alan's busy with Sharpe's Rifles and every now and then he stops to read something aloud about rum, or sargents or other interesting bit.

Comments

[amp23.livejournal.com]

i think in order to celebrate independence you have to be independent.

unlike Texas, Mexico is still a sovereign country (although Texas should be one too). but since the south lost the war, Texas was taken by military occupation and folded into the Union when the Republic was engineered into bankruptcy (the union stayed afloat by printing money, the south didn't have that luxury)

if the Republic of Texas provisional government is ever successful at getting the occupation nullified by US courts (about as likely as spontaneous world peace) i bet the new "independence day" would be whatever day the judge rules Texas was taken illegally.

No

[auss24.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry, but I never heard of Texas' decision to join the union having anything to do with the civil war and military occupation.
The nation became a state in 1845.
The civil war did not begin until almost 16 years later in 1861.
Perhaps you're thinking of the reason why Texas was a none - issue in the civil war. Our harbors were completely blockaded for almost the entire duration, rendering us pretty useless during most of the fighting.
And the loophole that would allow Texas to become it's own state again was nullified by the state congress a few years back, after those succession crazies were chased up into the mountains and shot.
And I see your point but I still beleive in celebrating Texas Independance day. Our state has a history richer than any other. I'm proud to celebrate any part of that history.

Re: No

[amp23.livejournal.com]

i was under the impression that the move to statehood was never properly ratified pre-civil war, and thus Texas became a part of the Union when the Confederacy was occupiied by the north afterward. my mistake.

i didn't mean to say that Texans shouldn't know or be proud of their history, just that 'Independence Day' usually implies national sovereignty, which our state unfortunately no longer has.

Re: No

[auss24.livejournal.com]

I'm not so sure about the ratification. I would think they could get something like that taken care of in 16 years and had always thought they had, but who knows. Beuracracy *shrugs*
Well, the way I feel about it. We're still a singular entity in many ways. Culturaly and the like. Maybe 'unique' is a better word. But independance day works for me.

[lawnrrd]

I am told that one main reason the Texans wanted independence from Mexico was that Mexico was trying to abolish slavery, and the Texans objected. I am, of course, open to correction on this point, but, if true, I think it's a good reason not to celebrate Texas independence day.

Then again, I'm just a bleeding-heart. ;-)

Annnnd no

[auss24.livejournal.com]

Texas fought for independance because they beleived they were fighting for their rights as land owners and beleived that the nation of Mexico was encroaching on those rights.
Basically the Mexicans made what seemed to be some good land deals with settlers and then they all of a sudden became kindof shady.
They pissed enough people off and the rest is history.

Maybe.

[lawnrrd]

There is at least some support for what I said in at least one secondary source. A google search for "slavery texas mexico independence" reveals several others, although many are likely to be the products of revisionist nutjobs.

Still, I'm convinced it was a consideration for the Texans, at least. I don't know whether it was enough of a consideration as to fatally taint the Texan independence movement of that time. I'm a busy guy, and I can't really see how the question affects me, so I'm disinclined to look more closely.

Re: Maybe.

[auss24.livejournal.com]

I woudln't put too much weight on the results from a few quick google searches.
I know that one of the measures that Mexico used in an attempt to drive of settlers was the outlawing of slavery. But ultimately it was the Mexican government's intent to drive people off the land it had already given the settlers ownership of, and not the one tactic used towards that end, that was the reason behind Texas fighting and ultimately gaining it's independance.
I ain't sayin it's pretty. I'm just saying it's a bit of a different picture than you're painting.
So again I say that Texas Independance day is worth celebrating.

[rawumber.livejournal.com]

--is amused.

Did I mention one of my latest obsessions is Sharpe?

[tsarina.livejournal.com]

Are you watching the series or reading the books? I have never seen any of it, but Alan is a huge fan of Cornwell's writing.

[rawumber.livejournal.com]

Both.

I started with the desire to see the series because, well, Sean Bean, but I got sucked into the books. I want to read the prequels, but I need to read through the first twelve first and I still have a ways to go.

Damn them being so expensive!

[neflhim.livejournal.com]

Well, we don't seem to celebrate Jean D'Arc either. Dunno why, seems she would be much more worthy than Bastille day, where we celebrate the French storming the infamous prison and liberating like two people. Given the times, they were probably executed later for not being grateful enough, or something.